[H-GEN] Membership form

Raymond Smith raymond at humbug.org.au
Thu Aug 13 03:12:32 EDT 2009


2009/8/13 Russell Stuart <russell-humbug at stuart.id.au>:
> On Thu, 2009-08-13 at 14:48 +1000, Raymond Smith wrote:
>> I do not see how moving to a virtual machine which was, when I last checked,
>> being paid for by Robert Brockway is much of a change in the status quo
>> which was using a physical machine paid for by Miju Systems.
>
> Probably there isn't much difference, other than me not wanting to see
> the SysAdmin role drift out of sight and out of mind as it obviously had
> done when caliburn went down the last time.  To me, it seems when the
> people who setup caliburn moved on, Humbug's sense of responsibility for
> its infrastructure faded.  I don't know enough of the history to say
> why, other than I suspect having SysAdmin list hidden was probably a
> contributing factor.
>
> If there is a difference, it is one of choice.  When caliburn was set up
> and hosting arranged I suspect there weren't too many other choices
> available.  If it was going to happen at reasonable cost, using Humbug's
> contacts within UQ was the way it had to be.  Naturally the people with
> those contacts ran things.  Now it is different.  Renting a VM is within
> Humbug's budget.  It doesn't need special contacts - anyone can do it
> over the internet.  This means it can be done by anybody elected to the
> exec.  And since the Exec can now in a real sense "own and run" the VM,
> it should.

You seem to be assuming some sort of identity between the "ownership"
of the hardware and "administrative access". This was not the case.
Miju Systems owned the box and had generously donated its use to
HUMBUG. What was installed, how it was installed, who could do what
was entirely in the hands of HUMBUG. The only restriction on HUMBUG's
ability to operate was physical access to the machine which required
Mark, or I, or an authorised person to go into UQ.

My point is this: administration could *always* be done by anyone authorised
by the club to do so.

So what happened?

My understanding is that automated security updates were disabled because
it was not possible to upgrade caliburn to a "current" Debian. It was
not possible
to upgrade Caliburn because of problems getting newer kernels to run on the
older hardware without debugging which necessitated physical access to the
machine. At some point the Executive/SysAdmins decided that a better solution
would be to get a virtual machine going somewhere. Unfortunately, that plan was
not executed before Caliburn was compromised again.

Now having a virtual machine clearly resolves the problems around physical
access and will greatly reduce the potential for hardware related problems
(although the vm provider might screw up).

> Right now it doesn't, of course, thanks to Robert's generosity.  I don't
> know how long Robert will want to continue the current arrangement, but
> the fact we now have choices means the social dynamic has changed.
> Electing a SysAdmin, making the lists visible and allowing everyone to
> contribute reflects that change.

I remain unconvinced that "openness" will have an appreciable impact.
I suspect that people can be just as slack on an open mailing list as
on a closed one. I know that, on this, our opinions differ.

Far more likely to have an impact is a vigorous President who is willing
to crack the whip. Your proposal for regular reports with slackers being
named-and-shamed is (in my opinion) far more likely to have a positive
impact.

> As for Robert's generosity, somehow Robert paying more than a years
> membership dues each month for Excalibur's VM, and then also asking him
> to front up for membership fees so he can vote doesn't feel right.
> Trouble is I don't know how to fix it and stay within the constitution.
> I ain't no lawyer.

The simplest thing would be for other club members to pitch in and pay
his membership fee as "a sign of thanks".

Cheers,

Raymond



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